Test Level...
Community Forums/Graphic Chat/Test Level...
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| Hi all, Just testing out the flow of level creation for my Space Hulk fan game (which I am finally working on again). I'm creating 32x32x32 corridor segments in Silo and exporting those in 3DS format then UV mapping in UU3D and texturing in Fireworks. Then I convert them to CSM prefabs and put together the level in CShop and export it to GLS format. Finally I bring it in to gile[s], play with textures a bit, add lights and additional data, and export it to B3D. Seems to work. Here is a test level with some basic corridor components:  There will be many more different kinds of corridors, etc. (the concept is that the space hulk is made up of many different ships glommed together over the years of travel through the Warp). Not going for ultra realism here - just slightly cartoony to go along with the traditional Games Workshop campiness. What do you guys think? Cheers, Michael Oh, been working on some flash and 3D segments from the intro movie (not really a key part of the game I just thought it'd be fun to do.) I have about 12 more segments to do so this won't make much sense so far. First flash movies I've ever made though. http://home.comcast.net/~mearrin69/linked/sh00_-_splash_page.swf http://home.comcast.net/~mearrin69/linked/sh01_-_trajectory_confirmed.swf http://home.comcast.net/~mearrin69/linked/sh02_-_intruder_analysis.swf (better right-click, save-as - they don't seem to be playing well in the browser. They will eventually be output to AVI so it won't matter later.) |
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| hey, nice! I loved the Space Hulk board game... too bad that it has gone AWOL, I could still play it. Be sure to add corridor sections with doors too. http://www.gamenight.com/html/Games/space_hulk.htm |
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| Thanks. I never had the actual game but I think they are going to do a new version of it. Yep - I have some door sections modeled already. Was trying to figure out how to work that since I want the levels to be lightmapped and the doors to be animated opening and being destroyed. Going to have to do some kludging to get it to work right. M |
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| Very nice textures and level design. and a cool idea. Keep it up. |
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| Then I convert them to CSM prefabs and put together the level in CShop and export it to GLS format Unless you're trying to use every piece of software you own you can skip that bit. giles miports loads of formats that Gile[s] imports - and Gile[s] can rotate and position (and copy) objects. The actual screenshots look quite nice :) |
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| looks really nice, man |
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| thats cool, similer to my workslow atm, execpt as i don't need the level light maped I Silo3d segments -> My own own entity placeing program -> game |
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| Looks ok, if a little repetitive... |
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| Yeah, pretty. But add some decals, some dirt and dust, make it gritty. |
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| Yeah, it's pretty repetitive for now. This was just to test that the workflow is going to be smooth - I only five 'tiles' and about 20 textures. I'm working on more tiles and different texture overlays. There'll be some variety in the actual levels. Just for fun:  Filters gone wild:  |
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| Looks cool, I wanna playtest it! :) |
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| I am really looking forwards to this, |
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| Heh, long way from that ;) Tell my boss to stop being so demanding and I'll finish it...lol. [edit]Heh, Sybixsus. Too true. No real reason for using Silo. I just sort of dig the interface. It's a really nice poly modeler so I was playing with it. I'll certainly use gS for the character animation ;)[/edit] |
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| Maybe the boss would be less demanding if you managed to fit GameSpace into your workflow somewhere ;) Screenies look great. What's the deal with Silo for prefab modelling? I thought it was primarily for character modelling. What makes it useful for this kinda thing? |
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| Has that image been mirrored? I remmember Terminators having the gun on the right and the claw on the left! ----------- Term looks perfect though. I'll be following this project with anticipation Will there be Hybrids, Patriarchs, Magus etc? |
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| It looks great!! Somebody wrote "help" on the wall in blood, nice detail. Though I think it's not very clever to use your blood for writing "help" when under attack by one of those monsters. It would be funny if on another wall the text "Aaaargh..." was written in blood, but maybe you want to keep it more serious. ;) |
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| How about acid burnt letters on the wall reading "exit this way -->" |
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| Heh, I'll probably leave off with the goofy writing but I might embed a joke or two - seems like a very GW thing to do ;) I've certainly been having fun using the GW slang latin in my interface mockups. If anyone is interested here's something I did a while back for the 'movie' for the game. It is the smallest of the Space Marine ships, a destroyer. There will also be two types of frigates, a cruiser and a Battle Barge (battleship sized) in the animation - along with some Imperial ships.  The model is final but I haven't finished UV mapping it yet so no texture work has been done. You can see what it is supposed to be on the GW site (it is the Hunter destroyer) but the pictures there stink: http://store.us.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.us?do=Odd&odd=NewLayout&_do=List_Models&code=5848 Hope you like it. M |
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| It looks really nice. THE gameplay looks quite cool as well. I've never heard of silo before now. Is it the one from http://nevercenter.com |
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| You have dynamic shadows in the level? Looks cool. What shadow system is it? |
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| Hi all, @agamer - yep, that's the one. Try the demo if you haven't. @jfk - nope, I wish. The shadows are lightmapped in gile[s]. Obviously, there won't be proper shadows for the animated characters at run-time because of this. I might check out sswift's system - but this is just for fun so not sure I want to buy anything else. An update:  About half of the first mission built as a test - threw in marines and gs for interest and scale. The real mission will have more, different prefabs and textures. Still trying out the process to make sure it works for now. Hope you like it. M |
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| How are you going to handle the doors with regards to lightmapping the level? Will you have separate light maps for when the doors are open and closed? Or will you write to the lightmap in game when a door is opened or closed or destroyed? |
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| Looks cool :D How are you going to handle the doors with regards to lightmapping the level? Will you have separate light maps for when the doors are open and closed? Or will you write to the lightmap in game when a door is opened or closed or destroyed? Prolly the most strait forward easiest to implament is to sub section off each area that is inclosed by doors...make them individual entities or meshes (they can all still share the same light map)...render them exactly the same (texture + lightmap multiplied on the surface or whatever)...only difference is instead of the mesh surface being fullbright white...change the color to black...then when a door opens gradualy change the surface black color back to white... Another way is to include a black colored roof mesh over each area...you can then change the alpha if the doors are open or set it up with vertex alpha and change that manualy in game. |
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| Obviously I'm on my own here... but with guys that big walking down corridors that small aren't you just going to stand in front of them blasting with a dirty great big gun as they line up in order to be shot? Maybe I'm missing the point? |
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| Maybe I'm missing the point? You are, sort of... they were that big in the original board game too:  |
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| So what does one do in this game, obviously it can't be much of a shooter for the reasons I mentioned above. |
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| rob, u ever played warhamer, dungeons and dragons, style game? |
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| Original rulebook: http://spacehulk.barsoom.cc/sh1edinv/Spacehulk.pdf Rob, have you ever heard of tactical, turn-based games? :P |
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Rebel Star then. |
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| laser squad would probably be a good approximation of it. |
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| mearrin69: All of your models and the demo shots look AWESOME. Great job! :) |
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| @Lumivel: Thanks. One note I should make - if I haven't already...the marine and genestealer models are not mine. I grabbed them from Polycount to test with. The marine is from 'gwot' and the stealer might be as well - I forget now. @Matty, MSW: Heh, actually I have no idea how to do it decently. I was thinking of rendering two maps - one opened and one closed and then blitting over the appropriate sections as things change. Not sure it would work, though, and I'd certainly have to figure out what was where in the lightmap. Model shadows will almost certainly be kludged or nonexistent. |
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| I've played alot of space hulk games from all over the globe(well maybe two or three) :this ones =>best graphics so far, and as for gameplay, u have to make sure your backs clear as you run from the beast infront of u, and really KNOW ur way around to avoid backing into a wall as u get chased: Geanstealers Claws go through ANYTHING... Will there be a few, sort of more open areas (i know,: not in the game: I'm looking at a 1990 black and white whitedwarf article here) Like large storage rooms, where some of the larger of the species can spawn?= maybe not... Edit: Idea: What if, one first completetion, a new feature arises where u get to control Grey Knights with nem. Force Halberds (look to the old lead ones for design) |
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| I remember the last pc version I played of Space Hulk (early '90s I think) and there was a lot of sneaking around the ships, but constantly having to move as a group with at least 2 members watching your backs. This was because the Genestealers would tend to burst from walls after you've passed an area, as well as launching a frontal assault to keep you occupied. Your version looks excellent mearrin69 |
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| about the door's shadow, i have seen games where the door doesn't cast a shadow, play splinter cell 2, you will notice if you are in a bright room and then you open the door to a dark room, the light stops where the doorway is, it looks kinda weird, but you get so into the game that you don't realise it unless you are paying attention. that is the key, most people don't really pay attention to that stuff if you are into it, heck, Halo doesn't even have shadows for the ppl you are shooting, only the people that are artists and game programmers and designers and the like notice that stuff because that is what we are always trying to pay attention to (details,details,details). The common gamer who plays wont really notice it, or they will and just not care. |
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| looks great... nice atmospheric lighting... but man, you have quite a workload, getting from start to the finish line... more than what i have to do to get a decent 3d lightmapped scene up in 3drad... is there any reason you don't create the scene in CShop and do the lighting there as well... i mean, just to streamline the process... still... it looks really cool. --Mike |
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| I Geanstealers definately from Banshee Studios Space Hulk game, unless they got it from anywhere else... I downloaded that game like a month ago, though it kept crashing changing areas. The Terms great but i dont like the geanstealer to be honest. Its not that regonisable to the real thing, isnt tall enough, should have a really really long curving spine like a sickle moon, so that its backs almost horizontal, and should have its shoulders 90 degrees forward over the x axis so that the claw arms stick out, and the hands point out backwards. On the other hand the textures are good... |
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| Looks like they may have gotten it from the same place I did - unless one of them happens to be one of the original authors, which are: Model/Skins: Slightly Twisted (dbeswick@...) Animations: OmegaLE (peam_p@...) Sorry I don't have real names for them - this is what was in the model readme I downloaded from www.polycount.com. The marine is by: James Edwards (aka. Gwot). Funny, James saw my posts about this over at Silo/Nevercenter and made a reply. I guess this was the first animated model he ever posted to the net. Thought it was funny that it was still kicking around. As I've probably mentioned before - these aren't my models and they won't be in the final game. I am working on replacements for them. Sounds like James would be okay if I did use the SMT but it's very low-poly and I would like something a little more Radeon 9800 Pro ;) M |
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| That is some great looking stuff! Can't wait to see it in motion. Looks like you're having fun with Silo :-). I tried that out and it seems interesting. I might give it another go.. not sure. I'm using Milkshape3D at the moment which - yes I know it's a very "small" program compared to Silo - but it gets the job done. Not as intuitive in all ways as I'd like.. but it also doesn't have some huge annoying interface that I'll never use 89% of getting in the way. :shrug: How's the documentation with Silo? Good? |
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| The level design you are showing here is good inspiration for something I'm working on. I'm wondering though why you're putting opaque tops on everything. It would be easier to see characters in the corridors (and thus easier to play) if you leave the top of the level open. That way your view of the insides won't be obstructed (since the polygons are facing away from the camera.) Incidentally, obviously I'm not referring to the ceilings of the corridors. I'm talking about the blackness OUTSIDE the corridors. |
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| Is the blackness of the other side of each wall not still just the non-existant side of the mesh? |
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| I can't exactly understand your question, but it sounds like you are confused about backface rendering. Specifically, if backface culling is on (the default) then the backs of polygons aren't rendered. Thus you would see through into the mesh, not have your view blocked off with black. The only way to have black obscuring the view like in those screenshots are with a top surface outside the corridors or with doubled polygons for the walls. |
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| @Jhocking: Love to see what you are doing sometime. You do have a point but, IMHO, without the 'roof' the visuals just get too cluttered. It wasn't so bad in the original incarnation because I was just using textured quads for each wall section... Now, though, I have details in the geometry so you end up with bits and pieces that show up because they are facing the cam (sides of columns for instance) and it's pretty distracting and unpro looking. I think the best way to do what you're thinking of would be to add in the backfaces with some sort of darkish tech texture (like the one I'm using for the 'roof) and then partially alpha out the ones between the cam and an area of interest. Might give that a try. Camera control may help here. I plan to have an overhead ortho (maybe perspective camera) that can switch automatically to the moving character. There will be a perspective cam as well that will only be semi-free. Hopefully I can make it work out okay using these techniques. If you have any suggestions for alternatives I'd love to hear them! Thanks. M @MikeV: Yeah, Silo is pretty good and the price is right for now - though I think it's rising ;) The docs are 'adequate'. This means that everything is in there, but it could certainly use some more examples and such. The couple of tuts on the nevercenter site have helped me with my main questions though (mirrors and poly modeling). |
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| I think it would looks better if the roof texture had some sort of tech design, or at least noticeable changes in hue. That would give it some depth... atm it just looks like a void. |
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| It actually is visible in the level itself. It's just not very visible in these shots. I might brighten it up a bit because I dimmed it too much last time around. M |
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| Opps sorry, made a mistake there. I dont program 3d yet, so ive only done about 3 days in the b3d demo. |
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